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Old 01-04-2018, 05:46 PM   #1
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Default Frank Martin says the Gamecocks have no leadership

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Old 01-04-2018, 07:02 PM   #2
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Default Re: Frank Martin says the Gamecocks have no leadership

Leadership starts with the head coach. He recruited these players and if he has a roster of guys who can't be player leaders this is all his fault. I have been in Martin's corner but I am tired of him placing the blame on the players and the fans. He needs to look at Frank Martin. These are all his recruits, no one else to blame.
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Old 01-04-2018, 07:09 PM   #3
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Default Re: Frank Martin says the Gamecocks have no leadership

Did you post your own gamecock hating article again?
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Old 01-04-2018, 07:12 PM   #4
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Default Re: Frank Martin says the Gamecocks have no leadership

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Did you post your own gamecock hating article again?
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Old 01-04-2018, 07:22 PM   #5
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Default Re: Frank Martin says the Gamecocks have no leadership

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Old 01-04-2018, 07:34 PM   #6
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Default Re: Frank Martin says the Gamecocks have no leadership

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Old 01-04-2018, 08:24 PM   #7
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Default Re: Frank Martin says the Gamecocks have no leadership

Some fans don't like objective opinions from homers, Chris. The self-promotion is probably part of it as well, but keep up the good work.

This team has too many problems to overcome this season, imo. Our conference schedule is going to be a reality check for Frank and his lackluster recruiting.
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Old 01-04-2018, 08:39 PM   #8
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Default Re: Frank Martin says the Gamecocks have no leadership

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Some fans don't like objective opinions from homers, Chris. The self-promotion is probably part of it as well, but keep up the good work.

This team has too many problems to overcome this season, imo. Our conference schedule is going to be a reality check for Frank and his lackluster recruiting.
That is because they know its true and they are angry and need someone to take it out on, that means anyone that has something to say about the team that they don't have the balls to. It's funny though I think the fanbase is mostly okay with a slow rebuilding year and are gearing up for better years ahead. But that just doesn't seem good enough for some. They demand packed arenas with loud crazy crowds to watch an seriously outmanned team lose over and over again. Our fans know when we have a good team and when we don't. They aren't usually fooled by sunshine pumping.
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Old 01-04-2018, 08:48 PM   #9
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Default Re: Frank Martin says the Gamecocks have no leadership

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Leadership starts with the head coach. He recruited these players and if he has a roster of guys who can't be player leaders this is all his fault. I have been in Martin's corner but I am tired of him placing the blame on the players and the fans. He needs to look at Frank Martin. These are all his recruits, no one else to blame.

Does everyone just forget about the BB Gun disaster? That cost Frank his next wave of talent, and he's had to scramble to replace what would have been a solid core.

Add Stroman, Ray Doby, Eric Cobb, and Jamal Gregory to this team and we don't miss a beat. I understand that coaches have to deal with stuff, but that's a huge blow for anyone.
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Old 01-04-2018, 09:30 PM   #10
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Default Re: Frank Martin says the Gamecocks have no leadership

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Does everyone just forget about the BB Gun disaster? That cost Frank his next wave of talent, and he's had to scramble to replace what would have been a solid core.

Add Stroman, Ray Doby, Eric Cobb, and Jamal Gregory to this team and we don't miss a beat. I understand that coaches have to deal with stuff, but that's a huge blow for anyone.
Maybe Stroman would have helped. He would be a Senior PG. Right now, he is the starting PG for the Louisiana Ragin Cajuns. And he would have helped only because of Felder/Dozier not being on the team, and Gravett/Holden being hurt. It is not like he is a star and the Cajuns are a step down in competition.

Cobb plays a few minutes a game for UCONN, which is not very good right now, and Doby is averaging 7.9 in JUCO. Neither would play ahead of Silva/Kotsar/Haase/Minaya.

Gregory is still playing for the Gamecocks - the Jacksonville State Gamecocks - but as a reserve.

Frank might have done a better job of developing them if they were still here, but they would not be stars, or better than our current players.
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Old 01-04-2018, 10:29 PM   #11
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Default Re: Frank Martin says the Gamecocks have no leadership

This is becoming a clear transition year. Oh well.
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Old 01-04-2018, 10:31 PM   #12
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Default Re: Frank Martin says the Gamecocks have no leadership

Recruit leaders. Recruit talented players.
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Old 01-04-2018, 10:34 PM   #13
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Default Re: Frank Martin says the Gamecocks have no leadership

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Originally Posted by Ace Dilcock View Post
Maybe Stroman would have helped. He would be a Senior PG. Right now, he is the starting PG for the Louisiana Ragin Cajuns. And he would have helped only because of Felder/Dozier not being on the team, and Gravett/Holden being hurt. It is not like he is a star and the Cajuns are a step down in competition.

Cobb plays a few minutes a game for UCONN, which is not very good right now, and Doby is averaging 7.9 in JUCO. Neither would play ahead of Silva/Kotsar/Haase/Minaya.

Gregory is still playing for the Gamecocks - the Jacksonville State Gamecocks - but as a reserve.

Frank might have done a better job of developing them if they were still here, but they would not be stars, or better than our current players.
Agree to disagree. Frank is a system guy who develops players to fit his style. It takes 2-3 years for a kid to really serve that system well. My point is it's not about talent. It's about time and continuity.
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Old 01-04-2018, 10:38 PM   #14
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Default Re: Frank Martin says the Gamecocks have no leadership

A leader is just a normal guy that gets tired of taking it in the shorts.

It's an intangible that you can't predict sometimes.

Sure there is a leadership void right now, but I think a leader at the PG position will emerge sooner than people think and it will be before mid-season.
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Old 01-05-2018, 10:16 AM   #15
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Default Re: Frank Martin says the Gamecocks have no leadership

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Originally Posted by FilchCock View Post
Agree to disagree. Frank is a system guy who develops players to fit his style. It takes 2-3 years for a kid to really serve that system well. My point is it's not about talent. It's about time and continuity.
I put in the caveat that Frank might have done a better job of developing the players. But based on their numbers, none of them have the talent to be a starter at an FBS school. None of them played much as a Freshman except for Stroman, who was the one guy that we could have used - not because he is that talented, but because we don't have any Point Guards right now.

And Stroman was here for two years and still not playing a lot, and would never have been a starter if we still had Dozier or Rah. In fact, Dozier started ahead of Sophomore Stroman - as a Freshman.

Not saying they would not have helped at all, but their departure opened up room for better players.
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Old 01-05-2018, 10:26 AM   #16
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Default Re: Frank Martin says the Gamecocks have no leadership

Well he can't just say, "They are lacking at the skills employed in basketball." Not likely to get good effort the rest of the season if he pinpoints that one.
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Old 01-05-2018, 11:34 AM   #17
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Default Re: Frank Martin says the Gamecocks have no leadership

With having to completely rebuild this team every 2 years (it seems like) leadership is gonna be difficult to come by. Frank's complaints about the crowd is a direct reflection of that problem. The fans feel no connection to any of the players currently on the team.

We had Sindarius, McKie and Dozier as hometown/homestate kids fans knew and made connections with, and that took some time to develop as well. Who do we have on this team that fans feel a connection with? Sure, Silva slams and blocks shots, but his personality is not conducive to him being a leader or the face of this program. Rah would've been the man because he has ties to the state and the personality and skill-set to take charge at all costs.

These are just my opinions but this thing is gonna be a rollercoaster until we get more roster stability.
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Old 01-05-2018, 11:41 AM   #18
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Default Re: Frank Martin says the Gamecocks have no leadership

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Originally Posted by Ace Dilcock View Post
Maybe Stroman would have helped. He would be a Senior PG. Right now, he is the starting PG for the Louisiana Ragin Cajuns. And he would have helped only because of Felder/Dozier not being on the team, and Gravett/Holden being hurt. It is not like he is a star and the Cajuns are a step down in competition.

Cobb plays a few minutes a game for UCONN, which is not very good right now, and Doby is averaging 7.9 in JUCO. Neither would play ahead of Silva/Kotsar/Haase/Minaya.

Gregory is still playing for the Gamecocks - the Jacksonville State Gamecocks - but as a reserve.

Frank might have done a better job of developing them if they were still here, but they would not be stars, or better than our current players.
Good summary by Ace. If you're interested in a little bit more about those 4, here are their stats below. Had they stayed here and stayed focused (a big assumption), I think both Gregory and Doby would have developed into good players and contributors since they had flashes of that their freshman year, but I'm sure that getting bounced around hasn't helped.


Marcus Stroman: Transferred to Louisiana Lafayette and sat out 2016-2017. This year, he has played in 15 games and is averaging 26 min / game. Stats: 7.0 ppg, 5.8 apg vs. 3.1 tpg, 2.0 rpg, 1.6 spg. Currently shooting 39%, 25% from 3pt.


Jamal Gregory: Transferred to Chipola College (FL) in 2016-2017 and then Jacksonville State for 2017-2018. Appeared in 27 games at Chipola, averaging 10.3 ppg on 45.2% shooting, with 3.2 rpg and 2.1 apg. This year at JSU, he has played 16 games and is averaging 22.5 minutes / game. Stats: 8.5 ppg, 3.8 rpg, 1.4 spg, and 3.1 apg vs. 2.1 tpg. Is currently shooting 44.4% from the floor and 28.6% from 3pt.


Eric Cobb: Transferred to UConn and sat out 2016-2017. This year, he has played in 10 games, averaging 10 min / game. Stats: 2.3 ppg and 3.5 rbg while shooting 41%.


Raymond Doby: Currently playing at South Plains College in Texas. This year, he has played in 9 games. Stats: 7.9 ppg and 6.6 rpg; shooting 55.8% from the floor.
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Old 01-05-2018, 11:46 AM   #19
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Default Re: Frank Martin says the Gamecocks have no leadership

It's almost like he's talking to his players through the media and offering valid criticism in the hopes someone will step up.
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Old 01-05-2018, 01:22 PM   #20
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Default Re: Frank Martin says the Gamecocks have no leadership

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It's almost like he's talking to his players through the media and offering valid criticism in the hopes someone will step up.
^^THIS.
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