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Old 01-09-2018, 11:27 AM   #21
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Default Re: Strategy. What do you do...

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Originally Posted by Roosterdog View Post
Get used to the fact that 5-7, 6-6, 7-5,8-4 are going to be the norm and that's about as good as it's going to get. I've said this before and got bbq'd because of it but it is the stone cold truth- The University of South Carolina will NEVER win a National Championship. NEVER, Not going to happen. We do not recruit well enough to field a title team. Simple as that. We will never be able to put enough high caliber athletes together at the same time to win it all. So, to answer the OP's question- the best way to deal with it is to learn to accept it as fact and be happy with 8-4 seasons and Outback Bowl victories. It could be worse.
Pitt has a national title, so does Arkansas, Syracuse, BYU, Colorado.

Is it going to be common occurrence? Absolutely not. Will it take an aligning of stars and talent and luck and coaching? Yes.

I get what you're saying, it's easier to win with good recruiting and talent and history, but it's not impossible. And now with the playoffs and especially when it's expanded to 6-8 teams, there are going to be more chances to upset the dynasties.
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Old 01-09-2018, 11:31 AM   #22
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Default Re: Strategy. What do you do...

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Clemson has been getting great players since Dabo was hired (since Bowden really). Bama won another Natty. What's the big change?
The big change now is UGA appears to be the dominant team in the East. Ever since Meyer left UF there was no one who had the East on lock. The concern now is are we even going to have a chance at the East with Georgia seemingly putting a stranglehold on it. They coach just as well as we do and recruit far better.
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Old 01-09-2018, 11:47 AM   #23
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Default Re: Strategy. What do you do...

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The big change now is UGA appears to be the dominant team in the East. Ever since Meyer left UF there was no one who had the East on lock. The concern now is are we even going to have a chance at the East with Georgia seemingly putting a stranglehold on it. They coach just as well as we do and recruit far better.
The issue USC has had isn't beating the Elite teams in the SEC. What has prevented USC from getting to ATL is losing to teams they are supposed to beat. Every year during the Spurrier run, we lost some game that we were not supposed to. If Muschamp can reverse that trend, we will get an opportunity to play for the SEC Championship and for a spot in the playoff. Our defense is going to be good enough to play with anyone.
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Old 01-09-2018, 11:49 AM   #24
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Default Re: Strategy. What do you do...

Don't understand threads like these. Georgia and Clemson being able to be this good in such close proximity is a sign that we are actually in a good position to succeed. It means the talent is there, and if you have confidence in our University infrastructure and commitment (which I do), it's just a matter of putting the pieces together.

People forget there was a time when teams like Florida, FSU, and LSU were nothing special. You can create a brand if you have the resources, and all signs suggest the resources are available.
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Old 01-09-2018, 11:53 AM   #25
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Default Re: Strategy. What do you do...

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The big change now is UGA appears to be the dominant team in the East.
With their current recruiting, they could become another Bama.
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Old 01-09-2018, 11:57 AM   #26
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Default Re: Strategy. What do you do...

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The big change now is UGA appears to be the dominant team in the East. Ever since Meyer left UF there was no one who had the East on lock. The concern now is are we even going to have a chance at the East with Georgia seemingly putting a stranglehold on it. They coach just as well as we do and recruit far better.
They had a great season, but they were left in great shape/loaded. Granted Kirby deserves a shit ton of credit for getting those tailbacks to stay and for letting Jim Chaney run that offense, etc...but one season doesn't make them dominant. When has UGA not recruited as well as anyone in the country?

I mean this same shit, but worse happened in 80, 81 and we just stepped up our game in the mid 80's.
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Old 01-09-2018, 11:57 AM   #27
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Default Re: Strategy. What do you do...

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Don't understand threads like these. Georgia and Clemson being able to be this good in such close proximity is a sign that we are actually in a good position to succeed. It means the talent is there, and if you have confidence in our University infrastructure and commitment (which I do), it's just a matter of putting the pieces together.

People forget there was a time when teams like Florida, FSU, and LSU were nothing special. You can create a brand if you have the resources, and all signs suggest the resources are available.

For USC, right now, its all about evaluating and developing players. That is how we are going to have success. We get kids into camp, put them through the gauntlet, and zero in on the ball players. CWM has signed almost 3 classes to date. Outside of the first class which was pretty much a hodgepodge given the timing of his hire, I can't point to a recruit we have signed in the past 2 where I'm like, "nah". Our classes top to bottom are so much better than what Spurrier put together. Steve and his staff did a great job getting the elites and they did make their share of good evaluations during his time but the bottom 1/3 of most of his classes were usually poor. I don't see that with CWM right now.
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Old 01-09-2018, 11:58 AM   #28
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Default Re: Strategy. What do you do...

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The issue USC has had isn't beating the Elite teams in the SEC. What has prevented USC from getting to ATL is losing to teams they are supposed to beat. Every year during the Spurrier run, we lost some game that we were not supposed to. If Muschamp can reverse that trend, we will get an opportunity to play for the SEC Championship and for a spot in the playoff. Our defense is going to be good enough to play with anyone.
I agree, but even if we reverse that trend UGA will, at least for the foreseeable future, have more teams on the schedule that they are "supposed to beat" than us. It leaves us with less margin for error than a team that has more talent and is coached just as well. It's also why I had hoped we could hire a coach that could provide us with more of a scheme advantage offensively since we will be out-talented.
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Old 01-09-2018, 12:00 PM   #29
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Default Re: Strategy. What do you do...

We need to really work on being the SEC team for the Carolinas. We are never going to beat UGA in Georgia.

I would hire Dez Kitchens today.
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Old 01-09-2018, 12:16 PM   #30
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Default Re: Strategy. What do you do...

It's all about recruiting. I firmly believe if Spurrier would not have laid down on us in recruiting,things would be a lot different... even if he had stepped down as our coach,he could have kept working..That being said,we have a great staff now who does recruit their butts off,and we are getting better recruits every year..
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Old 01-09-2018, 12:28 PM   #31
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So fragile
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Old 01-09-2018, 12:48 PM   #32
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Default Re: Strategy. What do you do...

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We need to really work on being the SEC team for the Carolinas. We are never going to beat UGA in Georgia.

I would hire Dez Kitchens today.
2010: The match-up in Columbia highlighted the archetype of the rivalry - a low scoring defensive shootout. #24 South Carolina defeated #22 Georgia 17–6, pulling away late in the game. Freshman running back Marcus Lattimore ran for 182 yards on 37 carries in his SEC debut.[14] This victory set the stage for South Carolina's run to the SEC Championship.[15]

2011: The 2011 game proved to be almost identical to the 2009 game. The #12 Gamecocks defeated the unranked Bulldogs in Athens 45–42. South Carolina defensive end Melvin Ingram became the third player since 2006 to score a touchdown both on offense and defense in the same game, a 68-yard run on a fake punt and a 5-yard fumble return. He also recovered an onside kick late in the game to seal the victory for the Gamecocks.[16] South Carolina was the division leader for the majority of the season until the Gamecocks lost to the Arkansas Razorbacks, resulting in a Bulldog berth in the championship game.[17]

2012: #6 South Carolina defeated #5 Georgia 35–7 in front of a record crowd (85,199) at Williams-Brice Stadium, the highest-ranked matchup of the teams in series history and the first time the Gamecocks have won three in a row over the Bulldogs.
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Old 01-09-2018, 02:05 PM   #33
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Default Re: Strategy. What do you do...

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For USC, right now, its all about evaluating and developing players. That is how we are going to have success. We get kids into camp, put them through the gauntlet, and zero in on the ball players. CWM has signed almost 3 classes to date. Outside of the first class which was pretty much a hodgepodge given the timing of his hire, I can't point to a recruit we have signed in the past 2 where I'm like, "nah". Our classes top to bottom are so much better than what Spurrier put together. Steve and his staff did a great job getting the elites and they did make their share of good evaluations during his time but the bottom 1/3 of most of his classes were usually poor. I don't see that with CWM right now.
Sometimes with our old staff you got the impression that Ward and Elliot just didn't know a Power 5 athlete when they saw one. I believe Muschamp (like Martin) knows how to identify and develop athletes, even when it doesn't seem obvious.

Even when he pursues a less highly recruited prospect, you can usually see why he sees something in that player. With the depth of our recruiting territory, I think that means we can consistently be very good.
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Old 01-09-2018, 02:09 PM   #34
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Default Re: Strategy. What do you do...

I like the idea of a guaranteed acceptance of any undefeated team from a P5 conference in a 8 team playoff, which would have covered UCF this year. But, if they aren't undefeated... back to rankings.
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Old 01-09-2018, 02:24 PM   #35
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Default Re: Strategy. What do you do...

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I like the idea of a guaranteed acceptance of any undefeated team from a P5 conference in a 8 team playoff, which would have covered UCF this year. But, if they aren't undefeated... back to rankings.
UCF is in the G5 not the P5 so they would have still been left out based on that logic
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Old 01-09-2018, 02:37 PM   #36
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Default Re: Strategy. What do you do...

Although I too don't see a time that we will be a legitimate contender for a national title, things do change more than folks sometimes acknowledge.

We have been hearing since 2010 that the only reason that our fortunes improved was that the SEC-E has been down. Although there's some truth to that, it's easily forgotten that UF, a juggernaut under Spurrier and Meyer, spent most of its football history with success that was only marginally more impressive than ours. UT was impressive in the 1990s and early aughts, but in the 1970s and 1980s, they won fewer than eight games more times than they won eight-plus, and they have only won 9 or more games twice in the past 10 seasons (in the same period, we've done it five times, despite only having done it twice in the previous 100 years). The SEC-E has been relatively consistent for almost 10 years now (although UGA is certainly on the come), with a lot of parity behind a yearly rotating slate of one or two teams that compete for the division crown.

Saban is 66 years old, and he isn't going to be around forever. Bama will probably make a play for Dabo or Smart (the former seemingly more likely than the latter, although one never knows). When he leaves, there will be changes in both divisions of the conference. For that matter, recruiting or other scandals hit schools and set them back years, allowing for upward mobility... stuff happens.

It's possible to catch lightning in a bottle and have a year that's truly an outlier (see our basketball team last year). All it takes is a conference rival or two to get hit by the injury bug or a year with a particularly favorable schedule when you have one of your better teams to give you a chance. That's realistically probably the only way USC will ever get into the CFP, but such occurrences historically, even though we've never been the beneficiary, aren't unheard of.
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Old 01-09-2018, 03:09 PM   #37
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Default Re: Strategy. What do you do...

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UCF is in the G5 not the P5 so they would have still been left out based on that logic
Then include the conferences directly.... the point is only for undefeated teams though. If you have a sucky conference and can't win all your games, back to rankings.
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Old 01-09-2018, 03:15 PM   #38
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Default Re: Strategy. What do you do...

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Then include the conferences directly.... the point is only for undefeated teams though. If you have a sucky conference and can't win all your games, back to rankings.
What if all G5 conference champions are undefeated, then 2 P5 conference champions are getting left if they aren't undefeated. Not saying that is at all likely to happen probably a .0000001% chance
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Old 01-09-2018, 03:15 PM   #39
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Default Re: Strategy. What do you do...

The first thing we need to do, is break up and expose Clemson's (and everyone else's) shady recruiting practices. No more fighting fair and letting them get over on us. I typed a bunch more but deleted it. I'll just say, By any mean necessary.....
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Old 01-09-2018, 03:24 PM   #40
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Default Re: Strategy. What do you do...

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The first thing we need to do, is break up and expose Clemson's (and everyone else's) shady recruiting practices. No more fighting fair and letting them get over on us. I typed a bunch more but deleted it. I'll just say, By any mean necessary.....
I think I must be behind the curve, but I have seen a lot of board chatter here and elsewhere about a church that materialized out of thin air that is being used to funnel cash to recruits. Everyone who references it talks about it like it's common knowledge. What is the full story? And if it is going on out in the open, why hasn't someone been caught? Not naive enough to question the truth of it (or that our program does shady stuff too, albeit apparently not nearly as well), just ignorant to what the story is.
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